Oh No! Tag Neons!!

THanks, maggie!

I found that an egg slicer is the perfect width to make 1" cakes!

I made a template to use to cut out the larger paints... The purple was broken to bits when I received it.. I had to "add water and stir" and let it dry before cutting it.

Oh yeah, where did I hear/see that. Good idea! too bad we can't use our neons

Terina wrote:Oh so bummed out totally!!! But Wolfe neon is still workable right???? I didn't see any disclaimers on my cakes anywhere.

Wolfe hasn't put the disclaimer on their products (nor would they answer e-mails concerning their contents) but they are still neons and the label should be there. There are people that have written to Wolfe and are fighting to have the label added.

And I just ordered a Neon Tag cake too Oh well, live and learn

I know that and it's the reason I don't buy Neons neither for I nor for kids

Angel I wasn't commenting on anything you wrote (infact I was agreeing with you) I was answering Terina's question about her Wolfe paints.

Well, I wrote DFX to see what they had to say about it all. Yes Kat we should have a pitty party for ourselves. I SO use my neons ALL THE TIME!!!! I just would think if there was an issue then maybe there would have been complaints.

Does anyone know of any reactions...and why is that they aren't putting it through the FDA? I am really concerned because it isn't like this stuff is cheap or anything and I have some of my signature designs that we use to advertise with all over the place with my neons. They just won't look the same without the neon colors.

I will let you guys know if any of the places that I have written today actually write me back.

It is so wonderful to have a great community here, and a pool of knowledge that flows through it.

I was just considering buying some neons this friday, because they are oohhh so pretty, however, I think I am going to hold off now.

On another note, did I read Gary Cole's response right? That UV's are approved in the U.S.? So it wouldn't be an insurance issue? I was thinking of hitting some cosmo bowls around my area. I think the painting would go well with the tweens n teens there.

Hi Eva, I read it as such also.

Brandi Cameron wrote:Angel I wasn't commenting on anything you wrote (infact I was agreeing with you) I was answering Terina's question about her Wolfe paints.

Yeah I know. I answered at the first post. I should have say : "I know this information about Neons and that's the reason I don't buy Neons... "
My english isn't very good, sorry.

Oh sorry - I thought when you put the angry face that I had offended you. It so hard to read people on the internet sometimes

eva wrote:On another note, did I read Gary Cole's response right? That UV's are approved in the U.S.? So it wouldn't be an insurance issue? I was thinking of hitting some cosmo bowls around my area. I think the painting would go well with the tweens n teens there.

I don't get Gary Cole's response exactly. I thought it was saying that only Snaz UV paints are made with pigments that are OK'd by the FDA for cosmetic use, but I don't see any UV paints on the Snaz site. What am I missing?

Snaz has a UV party glo package set in the little cakes. I have never seen the larger cakes anywhere...not that they don't have them but I have never seen them. This is the link for the UK store, I http://www.snazaroo.com/products/face-painting-kits/uv-paint-kits/

I have not seen them listed on the U.S. Page...

I think it wise to be cautionary - however I feel like everyone is getting a little to panicky!
I honestly believe that if we take the time to look further into the information we have and as I mentioned on Clash's comments to the article, request MSDS for all of our products we can be a lot more confident in what we are presenting to the community. We are an online community of 3000+ industry professionals who are entitled to quality, safe and appropriately regulated products.
I have one TAG neon split cake which I use occasionally ( I really don't care much for the effects, I'm not a fan of fluro yellow) BUT on my cake it is listed as having "non toxic fluorescent pigments" 'hypoallerganic and non toxic" and I take comfort in that.
As for Gary Cole - I would think that a good percentage of content on his snaz site is related to the snaz products only.
With that said, wouldn't you think that 3000+ forum members would be able to impact a response from these companies to provide reassurance/MSDS/ proof or other to show they back the safety and quality of thier products and hold themselves accountable for thier developments?
(staying calm til the storm is over) - Leona

Well, I spent some time researching it today. Not a new issue actually. I just find it hard to believe there is an actual issue at all with it...My main concern would be in the event that there was an issue to come up would insurance cover you? I have never ever ever ever had to file a claim. So, I guess I could call the insurance company...

I wrote DFX and Wolfe this morning with no response...which actually surprised me as that I thought for sure DX would respond. But some of their paint is listed as FDA approved. Like the mini kit I saw today. I don't have a neon mni kit....but isn't it the same paint?

I just checked one of my neon tag label and it says this make up is hypo-allergenic and non toxic, it also says manufactured with skin safe ingredients.
I also checked on my dfx white and it has the same info.
None of them say they are FDA approved.
They both also say Conforms to ASTM D 4236

here is what the Europe site has to say about Diamond FX neons:
http://www.diamondfx-faceart.eu/index2.html

Well I am not trying to be a trouble maker but it really irks me that they can manufacture and package something as a face paint product if you can't paint on the skin with it. I looked at the paints that I just got today and I spent $65 on a palette that I am supposed to just use on hair? Really....what a joke! If I had known that I would have spent my $$$$ on something else. I am very disappointed...

I also looked up the disclaimers for what ASTMD4236 means...and check it out...meets standards for personal use only...so any of the paint with that on it is not regulated for commercial use but for personal use....that is very misleading.

ASTM D-4236 certification is only applied to materials being sold for individual use. Industrial and bulk art materials are not covered by the American Society for Testing and Materials.

So, if you are not using the items for personal use then I guess that is another out? How irritating...
And does this go for all the metalix and DFX paints? or specifically the neons? I have all kids of metalix in every brand and not one issue... I have never had any neon problems and I paint my lips and everything!!! Of course I do not have a ton of Tag paints. But I did just order some new DFX paints.

This explains the ratings below... [code]http://www.ehow.com/facts_5004792_what-astm-d.html

I think they are probably safe to use but no one wants to take the responsibility in the event if something does go wrong. Why skirt it all around in wording otherwise? Is it safe or not safe...isn't the last few years enough to consider our ventures clinical trials or something LOL! Seriously though, it seems that it would be in everyone's best interest to look over their individual insurance contracts to see if they are specific about the paints. Then it comes to individuals I suppose...it is funny cause I just got a letter from the acrylic people today to post on my site that explains the ratings and why acrylic is not meant for the skin. LOL! I will post it tomorrow. I am going to paint myself now with my NON face paint paints!

Just have to chime in here and remind everyone that "non-toxic" is not a strong enough claim for using a product. Acrilic craft paint is "non-toxic" after all.

Now to check the specs on the Kryolan pressed uv powders. Fingers crossed for an alternative...

no dice.

But there is still hope... Snaz has "cosmic colors" in yellow, red, and orange I think. And DFX blue, purple and white are approved too. That's almost a rainbow.

Gary said eventually someone will report them to FDA and then they will be forced to make changes. I'm guessing after all this uproar going on everywhere, that someone will end up doing it.

Just to comment on Snazaroos "Even the Snazaroo UV palette holds the
child toy safety rating" comment". Isn't the rating just for how safe the package is? So there is no small parts and so? Not how safe the product is on the skin?

At the moment the Danish health department are looking at the ingredients at the DFX neons, will be interesting what they conclude. Think they are about the most strict in the world. So far I am continuing using the products.

I have been following this topic since it started. My whole kit is TAG and I bought the TAG Neons about 2 months ago. I couldn't seem to make them work for me in the few times that I tried so they were sitting in my kit almost brand new. Friday night just gone I decided to make them into splits and rainbow cakes. Well I found the secret to make them work was using plenty of water. I used them on 3 jobs over the weekend and I loved them!! Then when I saw this topic I was concerned. The safety of the product on the kids is paramount and that worried me.
So I emailed TAG yesterday and here is the reply I got from them today.

"This email has been sent to us a few times now, please do not worry , the product is skin safe , however some of the ingredients do not yet have FDA and or EU approval for use in cosmetics.
These labels have been made up for the US & EU market to conform to their requirements".

Still not sure how to take this but I checked the labels on my regular colours and my neons and the wording is the exact same for both. Which in itself is a bit of a worry because in part it says "Keep away from eyes"

Terina wrote:I think they are probably safe to use but no one wants to take the responsibility in the event if something does go wrong.

I totally agree with you.

Maybe the "effects" are not immediate, maybe they are long term.
I don't want to take the risk especially with children.

Well, wait. Is this just about neons, or paints in general? Based on what Terina said, I'm a little concerned about my next order. I'd like to be sure when I buy insurance (soon!) that it actually covers something lol.

Are there any brands we can be really truly sure would be covered in the case of a problem or that we can claim are really truly FDA compliant?

"This email has been sent to us a few times now, please do not worry , the product is skin safe , however some of the ingredients do not yet have FDA and or EU approval for use in cosmetics.These labels have been made up for the US & EU market to conform to their requirements".

I think that this really just states that it is a safety precaution.I seriously doubt that there are major issues. I am curious to see how all of this will pan out. I still have not heard from anyone that I wrote though.

As far as acrylics, this is what I received yesterday...so they state that for small children that have not developed an immune system and they can have potential rashes and reactions from the paint....
Although Ceramcoat paints have been certified as AP non-toxic by the Arts and Crafts Material Institute, we do not recommend the use of our acrylic paint for face painting. Generally speaking, it will not cause rashes or allergic reactions to the skin. However, for small children and babies that have not completely developed an immune system may have results in an allergic reaction. Should the paint be accidentally rubbed from the hands to the eyes, it could cause some serious eye problems, especially with children.

It is our recommendation to use paints that are specifically formulated for this purpose.

What do the ACMI Seals mean?

The new AP (Approved Product) Seal, with or without Performance Certification, identifies art materials that are safe and that are certified in a toxicological evaluation by a medical expert to contain no materials in sufficient quantities to be toxic or injurious to humans, including children, or to cause acute or chronic health problems. This seal is currently replacing the previous non-toxic seals: CP (Certified Product), AP (Approved Product), and HL Health Label (Non-Toxic) over a 10-year phase-in period. Such products are certified by ACMI to be labeled in accordance with the chronic hazard labeling standard, ASTM D 4236, and the U. S. Labeling of Hazardous Art Materials Act (LHAMA). Additionally, products bearing the AP Seal with Performance Certification or the CP Seal are certified to meet specific requirements of material, workmanship, working qualities, and color developed by ACMI and others through recognized standards organizations, such as the American National Standards Institute (ANSI) and the American Society for Testing and Materials (ASTM). Some products cannot attain this performance certification because no quality standard currently exists for certain types of products.

I think that it is probably the UV causing the issue here in the states. But, I am checking with my insurance company today before I renew my policy about what products are covered...The difference to me about the acrylics and this other paint is that the acrylic people are saying no that it was never formulated or meant for skin versus the other companies manufacturing and making it for the skin specifically. So, if a company can't get an FDA coding because there is lack of testing available or funds then that seems different to me than this is not meant or made for the skin at all. GWIM? I don't want to use something that could potentially cause issues for someone. On the flip side, I know that hundreds of people have been using these products and they have never had any issues. There truly should be something to say about that.

I am perturbed that they can sell a product as make up and then when you get it has a disclaimer that it is not make up. Otherwise, who in their right mind would buy a palette of "hair color" for that price???? That needs to be changed/ regulated or taken off the market. It is totally a misrepresentation of product. That is something that I feel can be legally changed. And should be...

Something that is not approved as make up in the states should not be sold as such at all in my opinion and should be labeled on the sites selling as what they claim it to be. Then the consumer can make a more informed choice of what they want to place into their kits. I am not saying that it is wrong to use the products, as that I feel like they are probably safe. But, don't jerk the consumer around that wants to be informed and responsible. Okay....enough ranting on all of that